Exploring Empowerment, Authenticity, and Success in Entrepreneurship with Celina Shands

Speaker 1: 0:05

Welcome to. This Is Source, the podcast that invites you to explore the depths of your being and tap into your true potential. This show is all about inspiring you to discover the power within yourself to create a life of purpose, joy and fulfillment. So sit back, relax and let's dive deep into the essence of who you are.

Agris: 0:35

Welcome Selena. How are you?

Celina: 0:38

Hi, Agress is great to see you. Thanks for inviting me to the podcast. I'm a big fan.

Agris: 0:43

That's good, that's good, that's good.

Mark: 0:46

Yeah, it's great to have you here. We're really excited. So, as we were just discussing before we hit the record but that the three of us have very unique and different accents because we're from different places in the world. So, as most of our listeners already know, that Native New Yorker that now resides in Wilmington and Agress I'll let you talk about yourself in a second, because he's actually living in California, but right now he's home in Latvia but this is great because we have this very unique sort of connection with each other, because I'm living in your hometown right now. The place that you had tried to escape from was the place that I escaped to. Isn't that interesting?

Celina: 1:29

It's so interesting. And I'm part New York because my mom was born in Brooklyn, so there's that connection too.

Mark: 1:36

Right, exactly. So, yeah, we hit it off right away, and I'm really excited to have this conversation with you, because we're going to talk about a lot of different things, but mostly entrepreneurialism and some of the great things that you will bring into this conversation, that we can all learn from you. So thank you so much for being here and for joining us in this conversation.

Celina: 1:58

It's my pleasure.

Mark: 2:01

And Agress. Before we begin, why don't you tell our listeners a little bit about where you are right now in the background, on you and your?

Agris: 2:11

accent, my accent, I mean. I learned English at 21. So, a funny, funny way that I did it in Italy, you know, and it wasn't actually in Latvia, because I at that time I was traveling to try to do modeling in Milan and I had to learn English. So I think probably I have some Italian accent to my English, but I'm Latvian. So, anyways, you know and we know, there is a lot of influence in from Italy in New York. So, you know, so it's that's the beauty of world you know we're living in. I think we, these days, we can so much connect to each other using different technologies. Really, it's so open up right now, and I think that's that's the most beauty, and I hope we can probably start with this. You know, and, selena, you know what is your passion to the world? You are an entrepreneur and you are. If you can tell us, you know, like, what drives you in this life, what makes you come in the morning and get out of the bed, and what's your, what's your thing.

Celina: 3:25

Well, I would say my thing is can be summed up in one word, and that's empowerment. I love when people feel empowered and are empowered to pursue what they want to do in life, and I've had now as an entrepreneur, I've had three companies. I sold one of them and I've had my current company, which, by the way, been a virtual business model for the last 21 years that I've grown into a national corporation and I just love it because it's what we do. It's a national consultancy and we do a lot of brand storytelling and strategic communications for those who are in the workforce, education and entrepreneurship sectors. So I get to work with so many people every day and it's really around being able to find the career that you really love. So we represent a lot of different public sector organizations who can help get people from point A to point B and have to tell you it's wonderful when we see that happen.

Agris: 4:28

Wow, I mean, empowerment is such a such a powerful word and I think and this is actually what I think what humanity right now comes into this individuality and empowerment to empower through themselves, to really to show how to live the abundant life. Right, so, and that's what you do in a sense, right, you show the way to the people how to be seen, how to be perceived.

Celina: 5:00

Yeah, and authentic life too. So not just being in a place for the sake of making money, right, Money just comes as a result of your passion and putting good things out in the world. So I think to do that you really have to be authentic and lean into what you're really good at. So many times people say, oh, I've got these weaknesses and I have to work on them my skills in this area. A funny story I was in college and I thought, oh, it'd be really cool to get a double major, one in marketing and business and another in computer science, just because I thought it would be good on the resume, right, I would get hired.

Celina: 5:38

And I had to keep dropping these classes because I kept like on the verge of failing them, right, Like I would get a D minus and everything. So finally I got a tutor and he said okay, Selena, I'm going to give you a piece of advice. And that advice has stuck with me ever since. He said you know you got to the right answer, but your coding was so inefficient you cost the company thousands of dollars. He goes stick to what you're good at.

Celina: 6:02

You love marketing, you love building relationships, you love communications, that's your jam, stay with it, and so that's what I've done. My whole life is kind of lean into what I'm I think I'm good at, because I feel good when I'm doing it right, I have passion for it, and then build a team that's very diverse and can help me with those weaknesses. So I think you know, being a leader, people always say, oh, I've got to know every little thing about everything, and that's just not true. You can surround yourself with diverse people who really support you, and what a team that is then. If everybody's leaning into their strengths, it's a good piece of advice from him.

Mark: 6:40

Yeah, that's great and that's definitely something that I can relate to, because I think that, you know, when it comes to wanting to be an entrepreneur, you know, at least for me, when you, when I first started my first company that was my mentality was like it's the one that's doing it all.

Mark: 6:57

So I didn't have the capital to like, hire all these people and find the right people. So I was like, well, I have to, you know, take advantage of the resources that I have, which is basically me, and I would try to diversify as much as I could, but you do, you end up burning yourself out because you try to wear the hats of every single person, you know. So I had a catering company and you know, I'm the chef, I'm the guy that answers the phone, I'm the guy that's booking the parties, I'm the guy that's going to the bank, I'm the guy that's. You know, and you can do that in the beginning, but you definitely get to a point where some aspect of all those things begin to suffer and I felt that it's almost impossible to scale when that's you know how you do things. So talk to us a little bit about that.

Celina: 7:39

Yeah, I think every entrepreneur goes through that. Right, you wash the glasses, you scrub the toilets, you do everything right. And I started there. When I started, my company was me and my cat, sheldon, and Sheldon would try to help me type and file papers. He was horrible at it but he had a good attitude. He showed it for work every day, but it was just me and the cat right. So it was crazy. And then once I got like one big contract, I said, okay, I'm going to take this and invest it in the company and bring on people who can help me scale.

Celina: 8:10

You cannot do it all yourself, nor should you. You will definitely burn out, but it's always a balancing act with entrepreneurs like when to take that step. And still, with this day, after 21 years, I just brought on a new VP of operations who is phenomenal, and some more employees and stuff, and my goal is to get out of the weeds even more, to have time to play and balance, because when you're burned out, you do not do your best work, you can't be creative, you can't be in the flow, and it's nice to be in a flow when you're working.

Mark: 8:48

You have any tips or tricks for so? Do you take vacations throughout the year, like? Do you take any breaks from your work?

Celina: 8:57

It was interesting. You asked that. So I went to a tumultuous time in my life and I didn't take a vacation for five years and finally I went to Greece for like two weeks and it totally opened me up to the people, to the food, to life, and when you take those breaks it really helps reset you. Like wow, I came back and I thought what am I doing, you know? So, yes, I do take breaks. I have. I ride my horses.

Celina: 9:26

Now I don't have horses, but I take horseback riding lessons and they're my passion, my little animals, and so I'll go out to the barn on Tuesday and Friday mornings. No one can find me during that time. I'm out of the office and I reset that way. I also reset during the week by going on walks, being in nature, working out, taking care of my body and getting like acupuncture and massage and all the holistic health tools that are available so that I can be highly productive. So I used to schedule that last and the tip is schedule it first, right, like, okay, those horse lessons go in first. If somebody says, can you meet with me on Tuesday morning, the answer is I can meet with you at 12 o'clock, you know? Or what have you? So schedule time for yourself first and then work comes second and believe me, that sounds so counterintuitive where it's like well, how are you gonna make it if you're an entrepreneur just starting out? Trust me, you will be so much more productive in the times you are working because you've have taken that break.

Agris: 10:28

This reminds me. I don't remember who said that, but there was this beautiful example of that. When you look into your calendar in the future, you just put those stones in, like you reserve those days for yourself.

Agris: 10:46

Right, your celebration days, your rejuvenation days, everything you need for yourself, you put in and you just let the stream of the water just to go through that calendar, or we say, just naturally to flow, because the daily life will find the way how to go around those stones and nothing bad is going to happen because it's still going the right flow anyways. That's how I felt, how you explain how you do now.

Celina: 11:20

Such a wonderful analogy, agra, and it's true when to flow like the river through those stones and say, okay, this is because when you have a reward at the end, like being my own boss, I may plan a three day weekend or many vacations or what have you you're able to do that.

Celina: 11:39

So that's why I love entrepreneurship and I don't think I could ever work for someone, because I love having that flexibility. As hard as we work right, you still have complete power over how you want your life to unfold, and to me, that is the most important value, especially living in this beautiful country that we have. As messy as it gets with democracy and all of that, as crazy as it can be, we're still free, and to me, that is such a value that I treasure. I think immigrants tend to treasure it more in this country if, especially if they've come somewhere, than someone who's born here. Right, I don't take it for granted. I travel a lot, I see the world and I go, wow, we live in a most amazing place. So as an entrepreneur, you have it's got a limit to what you wanna do.

Mark: 12:29

Right, and she's in Southern California. By the way, Agra, I know, I know, Agra.

Agris: 12:35

we had this conversation. Okay, cool, you know, I can relate to this as I immigrate in a sense to USA, like almost six years ago, you know, and at some point, like I think my mentality at that time was like, okay, you know, like I have so much passion and energy to achieve things I want to achieve, and sometimes I didn't see that already in people who was already in USA for the birth time, you know, and for me it's like, oh, I can do so much more. But then again, you know, like I found myself in that craziness. You know, just like in that state of achiever which, like we know USA, that there is the state of achievers and people. Especially if you live in New York, you know, or in LA, you know, those places where people really they don't pay even attention to themselves so much. You know it's like lots of greediness, lots of achiever mentality and people.

Agris: 13:47

That's at least what I felt at some point and I understood that it has to be some sort of balance, how you find the way, how you shift yourself into what you really love to do, not just adjust to everyone else to prove others that you can do it.

Agris: 14:06

So for me it was a big lesson in life, you know, and life throwed me out of that achieving state and, like sort of said, you are going to suffer, suffer a lot if you will want to be just achiever and try to do things, just to show that you can do it. And I had a big lesson and now I'm really shifting into do what I love to do and I feel completely different flow, even though probably I'm not making so much money at this point. But I feel, how you know, again I will go back to nature and I feel that I'm like the small throat, you know, in the mountains and I feel how I just start to get that more and more energy and I can just start to flow more and more and you know, and turn into river and just becomes so natural now. So guess, this is what you do, this is what you give to your clients, you know, just to open up them, do you?

Celina: 15:10

That's interesting because I think that's such an individual journey. What I like to think of is I try to model that as best as I can. When we work with our clients, it's often under very high pressure, deadlines and things like that. So our job I always say our values in our company is relaxed intensity. It's like wow, that's an oxymoron, right. But we try to bring some calmness to the situation and help them work through the process and empower them to understand what we're doing so that way they can be sustainable after our contract concludes.

Celina: 15:48

I want to just help them continue to grow their brands. So if I come to a meeting, I'll stressed out and it's already a high pressure environment. That's not going to help anybody. But if I come in or there's this, I just mention somebody has this opinion, someone has this opinion right, and then they're all up in arms. So that can be like as a facilitating through negotiating with them and saying, okay, let's look at both of these. So having that more calm spirit I think helps. I try to bring that both to my work and to my clients. You have to ask them if it works. I think it does.

Agris: 16:30

It sounds like it does, because I think that it's a beautiful skill. It's a beautiful skill to be I call it stillness, Stillness and focus in any environment so you can actually be still relaxed and focus on the most meaningful things. Just to get that whatever you work on to on the right path. That's how I see it.

Celina: 16:58

Yeah, and I think there's no big brick to it. I think it's really about just paying attention and being present with people. So going back to your breath and knowing that whatever is shaping up in the moment whether it's someone that's fighting and arguing in a meeting or about a project or whatever the case may be that whatever is happening is supposed to be happening, because if we handle it well, it can lead to all of us elevating to a different level. Maybe we get it. Oh, had I done this, just really trying to understand that piece and learning and growing from it. So, yeah, that's what I think is just being present. That's the key. For me, it's just like okay, I'm here in this podcast with you right now. Do I have a gazillion things after this? Yeah, but none of that matters right now. I just want to talk to Agris and Mark and see what comes up.

Mark: 17:55

Mm-hmm. See, this is amazing because we have on here a well-spoken entrepreneurial genius dropping deep spiritual truths on us here. I mean, right, agris, what she's saying is really stuff that we've learned in our spiritual journey. So that's pretty incredible, and I think that reminds us why this conversation is so important, because that's the thing is, spirituality is in everything, right, and it's not really separate from anything. But if we can integrate these truths, like you just said, into real world, into your business, I mean, this is.

Mark: 18:32

And one thing that you said that really jumped out was that isn't it inevitable that these things are going to come up? Like there's always going to be some type of a challenge, right, no matter what and I love that you said this is a good thing Like. So the goal isn't to try to prevent difficult situations from occurring or try to prevent us from feeling some sort of emotional state. You know, like we don't want to just zen out and miss out on life. We want challenges, right, we want to be faced with these difficulties, because that's what helps us to grow, right. And I think what you said is what you're bringing to the conversation, or what you're bringing to the table is what tools can we integrate into this so that we can manage this successfully grow, and guess what? Then there's going to be another one right behind it, but we're going to be able to deal with that too.

Celina: 19:22

Yeah for sure. If I had to pick between if you said, okay, let's do a multiple choice A your day is going to go so smoothly or B you're going to have a lot of challenges, Of course, I would pick A. However, I trust that when those B days happen, that okay, they're happening for a reason and I'll reflect in that type of thing. So, yeah, it's very interesting. I also don't think that you hear this saying a lot that business isn't personal, and I don't agree with that. I think business is very personal. When we meet with our clients, I like to build relationships with them. I want to understand what they're bringing to the table, not only from their company, but who they are as people, Because that also helps give me a heightened sense of how do I communicate with them, how do they like to be communicated with, what's important for them, and so in some of them it's interesting We've got about repeat business and our company is about 97%, so we don't go out and advertise and do all that.

Celina: 20:25

People just come back to us and I do a lot of just accessible.

Celina: 20:30

I want people to be able to come and talk when they want and I don't charge them like an attorney where it's like, okay, every five minutes we talk it's going to be X number because it's a give and take. But some of my customers are really good, not only colleagues, customers, but friends, and they think of us kind of as an extended family, which is great because then they know that they can count on us. We're not going to let them down. So I think just in the pure sense of getting to know your customers and vendors and having a relationship with them and truly caring about their life is a good thing for business, it's a good thing for your bottom line, for your success and all of that, so you can't again always be driven by the money. I was in the beginning driven by money because I grew up in a very sort of survival mode. That got replaced later on this company, my company, for 21 years. So a lot of teaching moments in that 21 years, for sure.

Agris: 21:32

Again, another talent to know how to listen, to know how to listen to your clients, to really to care about them, because there are so many situations when actually like, oh, I don't care, I don't care what you do or whatever, or what you care about, then, yeah, then it just becomes about money or about some sort of service, and I think it's beautiful that you actually care, you listen, with the love, and then it just becomes a beautiful I would say it's a beautiful business love story In a, you know, not like in a drama way, but it's just a beautiful exchange of the energy. And it is right, because business is exchange of energy and goods and it just becomes a beautiful way of expressing it.

Celina: 22:28

Yeah, it doesn't have to be so transactional. You know it can be. I mean some some. Yes, we've got deadlines, we have to deliver services and all that but it doesn't have to be that way and same with your colleagues with whom you work.

Celina: 22:43

I think you know, having a place that allows diversity and allows people's voices to be heard, they're going to solve it If you empower them. There's that word again in team meetings. Or one of my favorite things is we'll get a new contract and I'll go to them and say, okay, here's the project, here's what I think we could do, some strategies. Now let's tear that apart and you guys make it better, you know, and what do you think about this? So there's a free flow of exchange. Just because I'm a leader doesn't mean I can't learn, nor do I learn, nor do I know the best in all situations. So I really value those voices on the team so that they contribute and then we have a better product or service to give to our customer and so that that flow also happens within our own team as well.

Agris: 23:34

So it's important to ask questions to your team.

Celina: 23:38

Absolutely yes. What do you think? This is how I'm seeing it. What do you feel? Have you read any research to counter this? You know, what are your? Just all kinds of questions, yeah. And then we get to a place it's like okay, and then I trust them to do their jobs. I don't, I do not like to micromanage, nor nor do I get people around you. You build that trust and then that in turn, empowers their voice to come out even further. We have some lively discussions.

Agris: 24:09

We need in every business, boss like you, you know, leader like you. Like it's beautiful. I am really I'm amazed. You know how those, those skills which you put on right and which you are now expressing, I think it's so important, it's a true leader. It's a true leader just to unite, not talk about really uniting.

Celina: 24:34

Yes, it really is. Thank you for saying that. I and I feel they didn't come overnight. They came with a lot of hard learning and knocks and, you know, being able to be vulnerable as a leader I think is really important Because, again, it goes back to what we were talking about earlier we don't have to have all the answers, we don't have to to be all of this.

Celina: 24:56

Do you think that companies are waking up to what their brand is like in the workplace? Because the labor market is so tight and after COVID, everybody's had a taste of working from home and we have the great resignation right where people were leaving right and left and companies couldn't get that stickiness to keep their employees there. So they're taking a look at their workplace environments. I think many of them get lip service to diversity, equity and inclusion, but I think it's really challenging them as leaders to look at what is the workplace like. What is that environment like? So I'm hoping that's one of the trends I'm looking at in 2023. It's like what companies are going to really step up and start creating more of a work-life balance at work for people to be productive. It's very interesting.

Agris: 25:51

I mean this is, I think, somewhere I heard again I don't remember the source because the source is humanity itself but I heard that the situation is turning into that there used to be that anyone who are looking for the job they are trying to look for the job, but it could next year could be a situation that actually companies will have to really put into that recruitment really to empower, to show how good it is to be on their company, that what is the benefits and how it's great to be the part of that company. It will turn around in a sense that it will be all about recruitment and creating those environments for people who work for the companies and empowering, as you said, empowering and giving them that strength and uniqueness and that they are worth, that they are meaningful for those places where they come in and work. I see this really going other direction, like used to be like.

Celina: 27:07

Wow, that's such a powerful statement and meaningful. That word is so critical because people don't want to go to work and say, okay, my job is to enter data. Why are they entering the data? I think as leaders, the leaders have to show their team and I'll call them workers or employees. I think they're part of your team, they're your colleagues. They know just as much as you do if you give them the chance to show it. I think part of it is showing them why data entry, what that leads to, the bigger mission, like in our company, we represent organizations that have a workforce education or an entrepreneurship mission.

Celina: 27:50

We hear stories about these organizations who will go and recruit underrepresented populations into their classes, and then we learn how that training helped improve that person's life. There was a story I always share. We work with the Coalition on Adult Basic Education, who represents 79,000 adult educators across the country. Most people don't know about adult education and what it can do for them, but this lady was living in a storage unit. She was able to learn English, get her high school equivalency and take these classes. That built some credentials. She's out of the storage unit guess what? Making 60,000 a year and is happy. There are a lot of ways to that. Everybody in our company understands that the organizations we represent have that mission. Our work is really critical to getting these folks off the street, out of poverty, off a public assistance, and help them find a way into work that they are passionate about. Again, it's that empowerment thread that goes through our work as well. Everybody in our company knows that mission.

Celina: 29:02

It's not just oh, I'm going to create a website. Well, why are we creating the website? What is that website going to do? Why are we doing social media? What are we doing here? Why is that? For what do we hope to achieve for the customer? In turn, what is that going to do for our customer? I think those connection points leaders have to make those connection points for their colleagues and their team because that inspires them to go to work Very different than, oh, I'm just going to do data entry. Okay, my data entry is going to help provide information that's going to help do this strategy or whatever that piece is that's going to result in this. I think companies take time to do that with people. What is their bigger mission? Why are they even? What's their purpose?

Mark: 29:48

Yeah, I see it in a lot of different businesses today, especially in a lot of the larger companies, that there's a lack of communication between so many of the different departments that one doesn't know really what the other one is doing.

Mark: 30:02

And even with my wife she works in the hospital and it's been around for so long, right, and it was brought out by another corporation who owns like God knows how many other hospitals, and she'll tell me some of the stories and I'll think, well, you'd think by now they would have figured this out, but no, they're just running the same software that's been going on for so, so long. So I mean because to me as an outsider, it sounds like, first of all, they need your services. But as an outsider, when I hear the stories, I'm like, well, is it anybody's job to sit and listen to all these like five people? Because I think if one person was in charge of listening to all these five different perspectives, they could very quickly solve this problem. But that person doesn't exist. You know what I mean. So the problems exist and they're just solving the problem, but it's not really getting to the root of the issue and that just keeps arising. So oh.

Celina: 30:56

So Will said, we see that every day. That's why I'll never be out of a work or whatever, because it's like we have these challenges. But they're also really fun because you know, like if an organization wants to rebrand and say, okay, I've got this image out there, what have you? Then we say, well, let's go out in the community and see what they think. And I say, no, let's go to the internal community first, your colleagues, and see what they think.

Celina: 31:24

So, there's two analyses that have to happen. One is what do your own people think? What's the workplace like? You know, because that is an important touch point. You know you can go out as a company all day and do advertising, but what happens when that person interacts with an organization? What is that touch point like?

Celina: 31:43

And some organizations have done this really well, like you know. You think of like a Nordstrom. You would never think that someone would be rude in a Nordstrom. Or Southwest is another one. You know their flights are inexpensive and they serve peanuts and you don't get a seat, but in exchange for that, they're happy, they joke around, they're more laid back in their little khakis, you know, instead of like ties and everything.

Celina: 32:06

That's their culture, their brand, and I just think it's really important to think about for all the way around because, again, if people are happy at work which is my vision, I get up every morning and then I go what's the vision? The vision in the world is everybody goes to work and they love what they do, they have passion for what they do. Can you imagine what our world would be like if that was the case? So, to me, that's it, and there's a lot of ways to get to that, and that's what our customers help people to do. They help them find those pathways because, again, not everybody's cut out for a four year university degree. So then what do you do, right? So it's very rewarding to hear these stories from folks.

Agris: 32:50

Do you think we are coming out of that illusion of? I know that in spirituality, for example and I think not only spirituality we call this the times of illusion when we've been sold this illusion of holding the pressure, always be the first one, unswerving or not giving even the people. As you said, it has to be some sort of pause, you have to breathe before you answer. Sometimes it feels like people not even breathing and unswerving and making probably even more mess to solve afterwards. So do you think we are getting in this business world more and more that, that feeling that people are waking up from that part of illusion and really start to sensing like, oh wait, it's not only about bargaining, about that, I will do this type of job and I will get paid this amount of money, but actually I want to get that meaning out of what I'm doing.

Agris: 33:56

As you said, it would be amazing world that everyone just does what they love, and I really I'm a big believer in that because I think, like, as I see the world, every human being is very, very important the puzzle, energy, puzzle of whole. So basically, we are perfectly created to be who we are, to be the part of the whole. So if everyone just awakes to that, then we just start to feel in the real, real meaningful spots of each of us and become the expression of that beautiful, like beautiful energy flow. So that's how I see it. I see it too.

Celina: 34:43

It's beautiful and I think what's keeping, I see, pockets of success. I think COVID was a big disruptor among that and people are really reevaluating what they're doing and how they're spending their time. But we've got a long way to go and I think what keeps us from that is fear Fear from taking a risk, doing something different or, on the business side, fear that the business is gonna crumble because their profits aren't enough. What have you? So there's fear on kind of both sides the workforce and the companies and working through that again is the very individualized process and it's how awake the leader is going to be in terms of recognizing that in the company. I think it's such a important part of doing business. I mean, I don't see how you separate out who you are as a person, who your colleagues are as people, and the dynamic and the energy that you create together and that's worth working on. That has been my whole business model. Like how do you create those diverse teams in order to create the absolute best product and service? And if you look at it that way, we're creating instead of competing, right? Because people say, oh, I gotta compete, I gotta do that. Well, yeah, you do compete, but if we don't get a contract or I've done this one contract for like oh no proposal for like 450 hours and I thought, well, this is gonna be perfect for us. We didn't get it. We came in second. So I came back to the person who was grading the proposals and I said I'd love to get your input. I'm glad you found a vendor that you're gonna work with, but I would love to get your input so we could improve the next time. So after I went through that conversation with them, I realized I see why we didn't get it. And you know what? It's a good thing that we didn't get it, because it was not a match after all. So again it goes back to the things happened for a reason and all of that, yeah, it's a lot too, but that energy that you're talking about Agris, I think, is the key to a business being able to create. If you create, then you are gonna do really well.

Celina: 36:52

Period in the story, because you're looking at again different people have key performance indicators. You know, how much market share do I have? How much brand awareness do I have? All that's really great. And at the end of the day, I just say who do we have on our team and how can we innovate collectively? That's the key, and we always come through.

Celina: 37:14

I mean, we'll meet with a client and they have special situation, or in a market because we work nationally, and it's like, okay, you know what else we do? We use our intuition in making business decisions. Not that we don't use data we always have the data but at the end of the day, I'll make the final decision. I go with my gut. This is why I'm what we're gonna do. The data may not show that, but here's why we're making this decision and we'll share that with the client. They go. You know what that makes sense. We're gonna go with it and it turns out to be a great strategy. When I don't listen to my gut, that's when we get in trouble. So it's an interesting model.

Mark: 37:53

Yeah, it's incredible and it's huge asset and it's for people that aren't used to operating from that level. It's like a whole different world. You know, like to really I mean to really rely on that instinct rather than, you know, just to say it like it sounds nice, you know, oh, I trust my instinct, but because it's a difficult choice to make when the data shows one thing but you have a feeling that you should make a different choice, you know. So I'm curious when you're working with people, do you ever get, like where you just described it like it worked out perfectly, like, oh yeah, they get it and they trust you, but do you ever get resistance from that? And then what happens when you do get resistance from that?

Celina: 38:32

Yeah. So it's okay to get the resistance and I welcome it because, again, diversity in thought, right. So the customer say, well, I really want to do it like this, or whatever. Say you know, at the end of the day, we're going to do whatever you'd like. What we'd like to do is put some markers in place and, week to week, see how this is going and then, if it's not, we can maybe do a course correction. So at the end of the day, I'm going to listen to the customer, because they too have their intuition. I need to honor that. They're it's, they're the lead on the project, we're the facilitator. But as long as I've done my job and put every, all the options out, then I think we're in good shape and then we just monitor it. And then you know we come back and it's not like oh, I told you so no no, no it's like you know, we do the, we do the.

Celina: 39:22

Oh, this isn't so. Then we go have another meeting and say you know this, this KPI is not where we want it to be. What do you think about shifting this? And I may not do the whole thing right at time, but can we shift and see where this goes? So it's kind of it's very much collaboration process, because they're working through their own fears too. Right.

Celina: 39:43

Again it comes back up with fears and you can't push someone into something if they're not ready. Number one and number two their opinion is valuable, no matter where they're at. So it's again coming and finding that gray area. It's never kind of black and white. We've had some customers, you know, that have been with us for years, that keep coming back and they'll say, just do it, you know we're good, you know you're with me, but I understand, you know a new company, especially the entrepreneurs we work with, that are just getting started. You know, boy, there's a lot of fears there. Why do we say you know, having your own company is the best teacher of all? Because every single fear that you've ever had in your life will come up and you got to figure out a way to work around it, right, you cannot escape it. You know that, mark from having your own catering company.

Mark: 40:33

Oh, absolutely, and you know you brought up a really good point before about the COVID Interrupter. You know one of the things that you said early on in this conversation was about empowerment and that's a theme of our podcast, and you know we're really big into helping people to become more empowered individuals, right, and just having that awareness and just understanding themselves at a deeper level so they know why they feel the way that they feel, when they feel it, you know, and how they can make different choices. So I'm curious, if you have you know, because I know you're working a lot now, especially with creating programs right for entrepreneurs and stuff. So, with that in mind, what are some things that you can share with our listeners that are fantasizing about becoming entrepreneurs but don't really know where to begin?

Celina: 41:22

Right. So the first thing I would say is find yourself a set of mentors, and it's kind of like you've got to mentally clean house. You know those family members, colleagues and people that are in your space, and you know the ones that sort of have negative projection, meaning, okay, I'm going to share an idea, and they immediately say you can't do it right. Rather than giving like constructive feedback, which is what you want, you want to say, well, let's think about this. You know, is that really the best choice? Why do you want to do this? You know again, going back to asking questions, you got to kind of clean house when you become an entrepreneur and the energy suckers which is what I call them in one bucket, and they may be your family members and you can't get around them, but you don't have to talk to them about what you're doing and then surround yourself with the energy givers and those people that are willing to mentor you and spend some time with you. There are also a lot of free resources out there for entrepreneurs, like the small business development centers which are around the country, usually sometime housed out of a community college. Score is another one where consultants give their time. I can think of some other ones and then we can drop links in the podcast, but it's coming out of the small business administration. They're also for minority entrepreneurs a lot of grants and funding that is available. We're working right now with a campaign in Contra Costa, California, called Think Contra Costa, and we're doing this concept of pop up business resource centers, where we have this network of public partner public and private partners who want entrepreneurs to succeed and grow business, say in Contra Costa County, as this example but to get through the maze of public assistance and everything is crazy. So this is kind of like a one stop shop that we're putting together with events and consultations and tools and resources. So I'll try to put together some of those resources for folks because that will help. And then just making sure you have a really solid business and marketing plan, which is what we help entrepreneurs do before you launch.

Celina: 43:33

Understanding your market it does require data because you want to see who's out there doing similar things and what do you do differently than those folks. So your unique selling proposition, if you will, what is that? That's really critical to find out and guess what. We tie the entrepreneur into that, not just the company. But it's so cool? Because the entrepreneur is the company right, so we can't separate out the two. They come together. So what's unique about the entrepreneur, what's unique about the company itself? And then, going from there, I would say get good mentors and surround yourself with the right people.

Mark: 44:15

I think that's great advice and I think it reminds me I was probably in business for about, let's see, maybe eight years and my cousin was working for ConEd, so in New York City, and he called me up and he said I think you should look into this opportunity. It's called workshop in business opportunity, right, it's Webo, it's an acronym and so he told me oh, it's for, like, budging entrepreneurs that want to start a business and they offer this. It's a free program that they put together and basically it's a whole bunch of really successful entrepreneurs that get together and they donate their time helping young individuals and it's all laid out in a curriculum and it takes a certain amount of weeks and you have to show up and you have to do your homework. Once you commit, you have to do everything that they ask. So I would have never looked into this. I was already making money. I was already like felt good about where I was. I was growing every year and he just kept pressing me like come on, you, just you got to look into it. So finally I signed up for it and I'm sitting down in this class and everyone's like you know, like just this is my idea. I want to open up an L Solana.

Mark: 45:22

Anyway, I'm like, well, I think I'm in the wrong place because I've been in business for eight years now. Right, I'm like, well, I'm the type of person that I made the cut and I'm sitting in a seat and so I'm going to go through with it, and I have to tell you I ended up being the best education I ever got, because not only did I connect with people that have already made tons of mistakes that they were willing to share with me, but also I had never sat down and gone through, like piece by piece, everything that you're talking about. Right, it was like I only got to that point when I had to. You know like, oh, I don't have a mission. What's our mission, you know?

Mark: 45:55

So it was broken all down like that. It was amazing. So I was forced to work through all that every single week and I ended up growing. I think it was like it was insane how much I grew in that one year and I, like I did anything that different. All I did was focus. I sat down and, like, put all my energy into the company itself.

Celina: 46:17

Brilliant. I love that you could learn so much from others' mistakes I mean just having conversations so that's invaluable. It's invaluable.

Mark: 46:26

And then it's funny because when I got to Wilmington so now I had, you know, left New York and so I was I was already coaching, but when I came here it was like I knew I was going to start over here right. Like now I'm going to start a new corporation in North Carolina because I closed down what was going on in New York and New Jersey and the first thing I did was go to the small business development center and sat down with the counselor and it's like I was already an entrepreneur for 21 years. So it might have seemed silly to somebody like, why do you need someone you know to tell you what to do? And it's like, well, because there's something about sitting down having a conversation with a fumbling around, talking about like this is what I want to do, making sure my vision is clear, what I want it to look like. You know, what's the what's the customer that I want to tune into.

Mark: 47:11

And I think as entrepreneurs sometimes we fall into a trap of thinking we know everything and we have it all figured out, you know. But I think that's very, it's like a very narrow minded perception and when we sit down with other people and we talk about it specifically people that not only have the expertise but they're willing to share. You know like they're actually excited to share what they know and they're not just like excited to tell you how much money they made. I think that it's like putting fertilizer on something that you want to grow and it just kind of takes off from there.

Celina: 47:40

So so true, and you know the thing about it is, as entrepreneurs, our companies are our children, right, they're our babies and we're too close to them. You know, we are too close to them and somehow sometimes when we think about what our mission is and how we're communicating out there and you're not getting feedback on what that, how that is received, communications of two way street. So there's the giver, there's the receiver, right? So as the receiver, is that message being received the way you intended it? And oftentimes it's like, oh no, it may not be. So just some small tweaks and how you're communicating and how your position in the market can make a huge difference on your bottom line and ability to get new customers.

Mark: 48:26

Right, yeah, and a lot of times I mean not always, but a lot of times entrepreneurs in general are very creative people and so they have like all this cloud of all these ideas swirling around them and it makes sense to them. But until you sit down and try to communicate that to somebody else, as soon as you see that glazed over, look on someone's face, you know like, oh wait, I think I need to like boil this down to something that's like palatable, you know.

Agris: 48:52

I like what you mentioned, actually how you perceive yourself in those business relationships that you are not taking authority for the client but you actually are a facilitator. You know you. Actually it's the same like you are holding the we call it frequency. You hold the frequency for the client and actually just giving him, answering their questions and giving them more questions. And I think the truth, really always the truth, is we know each of us has own truth, right, so it just has to be questions, because if there are no questions, you cannot progress into whatever you do or whatever you imagine to do or what's your vision.

Agris: 49:41

And once, if you took that, as you said, the correct mentors, correct facilitate can not pronounce this word anymore, but somebody who actually are there for you, actually to support and not decide for you, but really be for you there. So like it's a good handholder explaining listen, my friend or my whoever comes to you, like I can help you in a sense with questions, many other things, but you will be the somebody who decides, you will be the one who runs the business. So you have to take that authority in your hands and find your truth and passion for whatever you decide to do. So that's. That's how I perceive what you said previously.

Celina: 50:35

Yes, at the end of the day, I'm not going to be around forever, nor do I want to be, because the our company's name, full capacity marketing, means we want our customers to be at full capacity so they can be sustainable. So the more we empower them to learn and grow and have the tools to do that, then we're not needed. And some people have said to me well, that sounds like a crazy business model, because don't you want your customers dependent on you and I go? No, I do not. I want them to be empowered and if they need us periodically or if they have funding for a campaign or whatever they want to do, they're where to go. And so that's why I like to do things like blogging and podcasts and things like that, because, even if you're not our customer, we have a lot of free tools and thought leadership things that you can get from our website and things like that to take that and grow. You know your organization, so that makes me happy when it happens.

Agris: 51:33

And isn't it beautiful that you you really like and I feel it like you really you know how the nature works, because that's actually is how nature works. You know you can. You can be a mother who shows the way, but at some point you have to let the child go and do mistakes or whatever they have to do in their life and you cannot be always next to the child and you don't want client call you all the time and ask what to do. Right, you want them to, to, to get to the state or to give the right tools for them to go and do it.

Celina: 52:13

That's exactly. And again that the proof comes back, because 96, 97% of those customers do come back when they have funding or money and they say because their trust is built in. You know, I'm not just going to take their money. I've been in situations where we've mapped out this proposal or they have responded to a proposal, and then we get in there and we say I don't think you need this part. I think we've already done a lot of work on this. I think this just needs to be refreshed. So you cost savings in their budget and we say let's save that money because we may need to want to invest it over here or something. So it's a very fluid process and goes back to, mark, what you and I were saying. You know, when I get in there with my gut and we want to do a course correction, you know we have the flexibility to do that. So I think business is very fluid, a very fluid process.

Mark: 53:05

It's funny because it reminds me of how I run my business. So I do coaching full time and that's exactly how I feel about my clients. I really my goal is to break up with you. You know, I don't want this relationship to last. And you're right, I hear from people all the time that's ridiculous and I'm like no, I don't want someone.

Mark: 53:26

You know, my litmus test is not for someone to say I've been working with Mark for 10 years and I always say you can come back for a tune up, like that's great, you know, but for sure it's to get you to that point where you can rely on your own instincts and that you have now gained a sense of your own authority. Right, you're showing up in ways that you didn't show up before we started working together, but then there's going to be a point where you don't need me anymore. That's the way that it should be. And how many people are on this planet? If I'm good at what I do, I can have that mentality and continue to always have new customers coming in the door.

Celina: 54:02

Ways, whoever is in your doorstep and it's like that's who you're supposed to be working with. You know, that is it. And if again like the contract that we didn't get, there's always a reason. Now am I disappointed? Yes, I have. I have like bummed or I'm upset or whatever. I'm not Gandhi, you know.

Celina: 54:20

I was like, yeah, I'm human, I have emotions, but I'll have those emotions and then I'm able to take a step back and breathe and say you know what, let me reflect on this, or I'll go and do something else and the answers come to me on why that is happening and the steps, if any, I need to take forward. So it's really trusting that the universe has your back and what's showing up is supposed to show up for you Thinks that nothing like that contract that passed me by, that wasn't meant for me, right, was meant for something else. There was a better match somewhere down the road. So that's part of it. It's not that I don't get disappointed, because of course I'm competitive in the sense that I want to grow, I want to be the best and you know, whatever. But if that doesn't happen, it's okay, you know. It's like all right, there's another opportunity.

Mark: 55:07

All right. Yeah, that's great and that puts you in the right mindset for being able to continue on your path and doing what you love to do, without like taking too much of your energy into the parts that don't seem to work out. It's funny because I want to say the things that didn't work out, like when I'm really listening to you I'm saying, oh no, those things worked out too. It's like a divorce. You know, like sometimes a divorce is the best solution. You know, like it's things working out right. That's what I'll say.

Celina: 55:42

It is, and the pain comes when we resist that. So I was there, you know, had a divorce, very tumultuous divorce, and then, at age 60, I found the love with my life on Bumble. And had I not gone through that? And I look back and I go, yeah, I see that it still is painful while you're going through it and you know, anything that is difficult is it's not the pathway. I always say, okay, if this could be really difficult and I'm getting anxious about it, I'm not going to do that. If it feels good, yes, I'm going to do that. It's a very simple choice now in my life.

Mark: 56:20

So, yeah, well, that's. I think that's a perfect place to end, because I think I would love to leave that with people. I think that you know, coming from you, that says a lot. You know to be able to say, like, listen, let it go, it doesn't need, it doesn't need to be so much suffering. So that's, that's beautiful. And I wanted to ask you about full capacity. If people wanted to learn a little bit more about your company and what you're doing and what you're offering and what you're creating next, can you share that?

Celina: 56:50

Sure, I'd love to. They can always find us at fullcapacitymarketingcom we're getting ready to launch last September. I'd love this Online courses and coaching for entrepreneurs on how do you really stand out in the market and the whole process of marketing and communications for their company. And then we've taken that same curriculum and adapted it for those public sector and nonprofit center and workforce and education, because it is different coming from the for profit versus nonprofit. So all that's coming out by September 1. And you just look at our website and go under the EFCM learning hub and then again feel free to download all the tools and resources that are on our website and blogs. We got a lot of free stuff out there. So anyway, we can help you and if you want to consult, you can sign up right on the website.

Agris: 57:42

Excellent, amazing. This one hour flew like so fast and thank you so much for sharing all the wisdom and I think the most important for me was just to see that there are true leaders and they lead not only by example, but give people that empowerment and knowledge that how important they are. You know, and it's that everyone is important, everyone.

Celina: 58:14

You're so right Everyone is important and I just want to thank you guys for the opportunity to have this wonderful conversation. I really love your podcast because, again, business and personal is all mixed together and as you help people face their fears, move through their anxiety and open up to their authentic self, that's only going to help them in the business world and everything else they're going to do. So your work is really valuable and I just thank you for your leadership.

Mark: 58:41

Thank you.

Speaker 1: 58:45

Thank you. Thank you for tuning into. This is Source. We hope that this conversation has sparked something within you and that you feel inspired to continue exploring your own journey of self discovery. Remember, you are the source of your own transformation and the possibilities for growth and expansion are infinite. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with your friends and family, and don't forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Until next time, keep shining your light and living your truth.